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Discussion With A Mormon
About Ordination

Part 2 - 2

Ordination: Part 1


Response By A Mormon Missionary
So what you are saying is that, as far as ordination goes, one can simply throw out the KJV of the Bible? That it is wrong? In Mark and John, it says that Jesus ORDAINED the 12. In Acts and Titus, it talks about the apostles ORDAINING elders in every church and city. Even Hebrews 5:1, says "For every high priest taken from among men is ORDAINED for men in things pertaining to God, that he may offer both gifts and sacrifices for sins". **This is why we need no other priests except those who minister the Gospel of the High Priest, Jesus Christ.** And this is what our priesthood holders do.

Note: Mormons only recognize the King James Version and the Book of Mormon as being authoritative.

Response: Meaning Behind The Word Ordination
You are confusing the translation of the word 'ordained' into English with the theological term Ordination. The Greek word translated 'ordained' in Mark 3:14 is 'epoiesen'. It means to do, (translated do 357 times), make (114 times) commit (9 times) cause (9 times). The most accurate translation is, 'he made'. In the New American Standard Bible and the New International Bibles it is translated 'appointed'. In the NASB the verse reads, "And He appointed twelve, that they might be with Him, and that He might send them out to preach."

Acts 16:4 does not mean the ritual of ordination. "Now while they were passing through the cities, they were delivering the decrees which had been decided upon by the apostles and elders who were in Jerusalem, for them to observe. So the churches were being strengthened in the faith, and were increasing in number daily." No ordination here.

Titus 1:5 "For this reason I left you in Crete, that you would set in order what remains and appoint elders in every city as I directed you." Biblical Scholars are in almost total agreement that 'appointed' is the correct translation of this word.

In John 15:16 the word translated ordained in the KJV is etheka. It means lay, put, lay down, make or appoint. It is translated appointed in the NASB. In this translation it reads, "You did not choose Me, but I chose you, and appointed you, that you should go and bear fruit, and that your fruit should remain, that whatever you ask of the Father in my mane, He may give to you."

This can not possibly be ordination. There is a vast difference between being appointed and ordination. Please remember ordination involves specific rituals and ceremonies that must be conducted in a specific way. It also involves bestowing a title, usually Priest, and specific priestly duties that must be done in a specific ways. These duties involve offering sacrifices for sins, as we observe in the Old Testament. In the New Testament this role is totally fulfilled in Jesus Christ who offered himself as a sacrifice and shed His blood for the forgiveness of sins.

Ordination, which in the past enabled priests to participate in this activity, is no longer needed. Now Jesus appoints his disciples to preach the Good News. We know the Good News is that Jesus Christ is come into the world to forgive sins 'once and for all' and to overcome the powers of darkness. This is now the message of those who are priests.

Please look at the context of Hebrews 5:1. It is discussing that Jesus is the fulfillment of this priesthood and was 'called' "just as Aaron was". Hebrews 5:1-4 "Every high priest is selected from among men and is appointed to represent them in matters related to God, to offer gifts and sacrifices for sins. He is able to deal gently with those who are ignorant and are going astray, once he himself is subject to weakness. This is why he has to offer sacrifices for his own sins, as well as for the sins of the people. No one takes this honor upon himself; he must be called by God, just as Aaron was. So Christ also did not take upon himself the glory of becoming a high priest. But God said to him, "You are my Son; today I have become your Father."

Jesus is the High Priest who is initiating a New Covenant, where he is High Priest, mediator and intercessor. By faith we enter into the New Covenant and are then 'in Christ'. In Christ we assume His priestly role. A role He has already established when God accepted Him as a perfect sacrifice and allowed Him to sit at His right hand. Jesus obtained salvation and now he intercedes on behalf of those who trust in Him. There is no need for those who are 'in Christ' to be ordained because Jesus Christ already fulfilled all the requirements for the New Priesthood and now His position as Priest is bestowed on those who, by faith, are believers.

We do not throw out the KJV but we must work language to find the meaning behind the old english used in that translation. Most Christians do not recognize the KJV as the only inspired version of the Holy Bible. As far as I know the Mormons only recognize the KJV and Book of Mormon as being authoritative.

We would disagree about the role of what the Mormon priesthood holders do. First they assume a position as a priest of the order of Melchizedek as BillyChoate claims. He says, "My current priesthood office is a High Priest in the Melchizedek Priesthood which I was ordained to last June by my father who also holds the same priesthood (I was also called to the Stake High Council which requires the office of High Priest). "Wow??? Do I need to say any more!

We would also say that Mormons add to the Gospel and that it is 'another' Gospel. Paul warns about this in Galatians 1:6-9 "I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting the one who called you by the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel - which is really no gospel at all. Evidently some people are throwing you into confusion and are trying to pervert the gospel of Christ. But even if we or an 'angel' from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned!"

Conclusion

There are several different points of view regarding the practice of ordination. The intention of this discussion is to cause people to think about the Biblical basis for this practice. Because this is such an important issue involving the leadership of the church Christians need to be better informed.

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